Germany has said Russia was responsible for last month’s drone attack at Leipzig’s airport.

A drone carrying an explosive device was discovered at Leipzig/Halle Airport in eastern Germany, close to Ukrainian cargo planes, on 4 August.

  • resipsaloquitur@lemmy.cafe
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    17 hours ago

    Respectfully disagree. Before Ukraine 2014, NATO was the answer to a question that wasn’t really relevant anymore.

    Even after 2014, NATO largely shrugged and decided that because of Sevastopol, Crimea was basically Russia’s anyway.

    Ukraine 2022 has seen NATO pull together arguably more than any other time in history. And Ukraine isn’t even a member.

    Donald’s attempts to weaken it may have strengthened it. He’s demanding Europe raise spending and take responsibility. Great. His threats to throw Europe to the wolves are more about extracting bribes and concessions. And to an extent, justifying moving chess pieces to Iran and South America.

    Even if he somehow completely pulled America out of NATO, that can be undone by the next administration. And even if it can’t, there’s nothing that says America couldn’t still come to the aid of Europe.

    • AlteredEgo@lemmy.ml
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      14 hours ago

      Respectfully disagree. Before Ukraine 2014, NATO was the answer to a question that wasn’t really relevant anymore.

      I mean, yeah. That was the purpose. Bush Jr. decided in 2008 that Ukraine and Georgia are going to join Nato, and Russia said they will do everything they can to prevent that. 2014, one coup later, we’re at war. And very clearly Germany is at war with Russia, sending war material to Ukraine.

      Has it made Europe and Nato stronger? It make Nato relevant again. It made EU and Nato the same. Now Nato 3.0 is already ratified to take 5% GDP. You think this will make Europe stronger? Lack of energy imports, now with Iran too, no fertilizer with 40% less food production predicted for 2027, AI bubble popping soon… where do you see strength?

      I see Europe as finished with a completely inevitable slide to fascism by now and breaking apart. It’s going to be Le Pen, AFD and UKIP ruling next. Most realist thinkers and analysts and professors from the cold war era is saying the Ukraine war was the worst blunder in the history of Nato. It was supposed to prevent war, not provoke it.

      And media and discourse has completely degenerated. Any voice to the contrary is immediately maligned as a Russian propagandists or bot. You get fired for having this opinion today. This is stronger? I thought liberalism made Europe strong but that is gone now. Meanwhile our Nato emperor is stealing Venezuela’s oil, good thing Machado won that nobel peace price lol. But somehow Nato is benevolent and has to be spread to all corners of the earth. You people are completely insane to me.

      Ukraine has been turned into a quasi-landlocked country and 90% of it’s warehouses have been bombed in retaliation to the wildberry escalations. General Kellog says conscription of women is a feminist issue lol. Lets just hope the winter will be incredibly mild.

      So you’re right, Nato was the answer to a question that wasn’t relevant any more, and we engineered the situation to bring us back into a new cold war. Thanks Obama.

      • robear@lemmy.zip
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        9 hours ago

        If you believe NATO is simply a puppet of the US, why didn’t Turkey, France or Germany participate in the war in Iraq? Why didn’t they obey their “emperor’s” orders?

        I think you have a problem conflating a voluntary defensive organization with the actions of some of its members.

        The US is an evil, imperialist power. So is Russia. For smaller countries bordering Russia, the only protection they have from Russian aggression is NATO.

        Ukraine decided to try to join the EU. They even agreed not to join NATO. Russia decided that Ukraine was their imperial property and wanted to deny it self determination so started a war that has caused over a million casualties.

        Any attempted justification of that is a justification of fascism and imperialism. And there’s only one thing to do with fascists…

        • AlteredEgo@lemmy.ml
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          2 hours ago

          If you believe NATO is simply a puppet of the US, why didn’t Turkey, France or Germany participate in the war in Iraq? Why didn’t they obey their “emperor’s” orders?

          Yeah because we used to have better leaders. See here what sane leaders had to say about Ukraine joining Nato in 2008. And how it’s now presented.

          https://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/library/news/ukraine/2024/11/ukraine-241126-rferl06.htm

          Concerning the 2008 Bucharest NATO summit, Merkel noted a pledge that Ukraine and Georgia would eventually join the western military alliance was a “battle cry” to the Russian leader, adding that he later told her: “You won’t be Chancellor forever. And then they’ll become a member of NATO. And I want to prevent that.”

          Six years later Putin launched the Russian occupation and annexation of Ukraine’s Crimean Peninsula, and followed that with the February 2022 full-scale invasion of Ukraine, which the Russian president has justified in part by citing Kyiv’s NATO membership desires.

          Do you think Merkel and Sarkoszi are tragic fools? Or puppets and victims of Russian propaganda for saying such things? This USED to be understood and called REALISM. To see the world as it is. Germany used to NOT want to be dragged into expensive wars, USED to be not want to be militarist. And now? Now everyone in Germany will loudly scream YES YES YES to the question for total war once again. Rejoice for the days of death and murder and the downfall of peace and prosperity in Europe are over. Remember when you taste the ashes in your mouth that this is what you wanted. Fools.

          Ukraine: How Merkel Prevented Ukraine’s NATO Membership (A DER SPIEGEL Reconstruction) - DER SPIEGEL

          That was the year that Ukraine was likely closer to becoming a member of the Western alliance than ever, before or since. United States President George W. Bush stood solidly behind Kyiv’s accession. But the effort failed, as Zelenskyy made clear, due to the opposition of Merkel and Sarkozy – and an “absurd fear” of Russia. Because of this “miscalculation,” the Ukrainian president continued, his country is facing “the most terrible war in Europe since World War II.”