Europeans are perfectly aware that 200km are 200km anywhere on the planet
There is a difference in the way distances are perceived; I was talking to a British person bemoaning that airfare was 200 lbs more expensive in Manchester than London, and treated the notion of driving just 4 hours as if it was crazy. I’ve heard similar stories about not visiting family because they’re just a few hours away by car.
The classic saying “In Europe, 100km is a long distance. In the US, 100 years is a long time” holds a lot more truth about perceptions in the respective cultures than you’d expect. I’ve had a very pleasant 100km daily commute - seriously, I quite miss that - and at the same time, there’s a building down the street that’s just been added to the historical registry and was built in the late 80s.
Meanwhile I’ve had German friends offer to book me a hotel when I went from Cologne to Essen to give them a visit (admittedly this might have just been learned pragmatism, I was taking the trip on DB…) and said hotel dated back to before my ancestors had a written language.
That really just depends on the scale they are personally used to though, for a fair few years I lived ~5 hours from my family (relatively far within the country), but it didn’t feel like very much because I/we visited my partner’s family on the other side of the continent at least once a year. Prior to that, I don’t think that I would have visited anywhere near as frequently.
The lack of Schengen and now EU membership may make British people more prone to being on the smaller side of this.
Sure, perception can change. When all you have is a car and a highway. It seems outrageous to want an alternative. When you are used to high quality public transport, driving there is a chore.
Driving four hours is an effort that you have to actively take. Plus costs for ownership or rental, fuel and lodging. Americans treat these factors as mundane (and the cultural romanticization of road trips that doesn’t exist anywhere else), but they have real costs. Sure, a plane or a train are more expensive. But it offloads a great deal of cognitive costs as well.
Are things really that bad in Europe? In Japan, non-HSR is cheaper than driving, in China HSR is slightly cheaper than gas, and in vietnam I can even put my motorcycle on the train for less than it would cost to drive.
Trains being more expensive than driving sounds like what happens when you have politicians trying to kill your train system.
Totally depends on the country and the route. I don’t live there but have family. They say some train lines are comparable to a plane ticket. Some are cheaper, some are more expensive. The most expensive ones are usually the ones that cross national borders. Though overall the train will always be considered a tiny bit more expensive, it will also be a lot more comfortable. Since the airlines with tickets cheaper than trains usually offer the tiniest seats with zero amenities.
Some countries are better than others as well. In England, trains can get you almost anywhere relatively comfortable and fast (yes, some caveats exist). Spain is rather good in the central regions but many places have spotty coverage. While in Switzerland you can go virtually everywhere except the alps without ever sitting in a car.
The big comparison, that most people fail at, is not just the price of gas. Cars are taxed heavily almost everywhere in the EU. And the tight emissions regulations also require a lot of regular maintenance. So the train will always be more expensive than just the gas, but not more expensive than the bigger picture of car ownership. Plus, if you drive, you’re the sod stuck driving the whole way.
I meant like paying someone else to drive the plane/train/bus. Not the AI kind.
Having to drive everywhere makes people misserable.
Edit: we take for granted the infrastructure required to support a society that drives everywhere in personal cars. That is what is actually driving the species to extinction via climate change.
Being trapped and anxious makes people miserable; lots of people are scared of driving (because they’re bad at it and/or have attached anxiety), and sitting in traffic is frustrating. There’s lots of very good reasons to choose mass transit. The unwillingness to be engaged with the task of driving a car for a few hours is not a good reason, it’s a symptom of a totally cooked attention span.
There is a difference in the way distances are perceived; I was talking to a British person bemoaning that airfare was 200 lbs more expensive in Manchester than London, and treated the notion of driving just 4 hours as if it was crazy. I’ve heard similar stories about not visiting family because they’re just a few hours away by car.
The classic saying “In Europe, 100km is a long distance. In the US, 100 years is a long time” holds a lot more truth about perceptions in the respective cultures than you’d expect. I’ve had a very pleasant 100km daily commute - seriously, I quite miss that - and at the same time, there’s a building down the street that’s just been added to the historical registry and was built in the late 80s.
Meanwhile I’ve had German friends offer to book me a hotel when I went from Cologne to Essen to give them a visit (admittedly this might have just been learned pragmatism, I was taking the trip on DB…) and said hotel dated back to before my ancestors had a written language.
That really just depends on the scale they are personally used to though, for a fair few years I lived ~5 hours from my family (relatively far within the country), but it didn’t feel like very much because I/we visited my partner’s family on the other side of the continent at least once a year. Prior to that, I don’t think that I would have visited anywhere near as frequently.
The lack of Schengen and now EU membership may make British people more prone to being on the smaller side of this.
Sure, perception can change. When all you have is a car and a highway. It seems outrageous to want an alternative. When you are used to high quality public transport, driving there is a chore.
Driving four hours is an effort that you have to actively take. Plus costs for ownership or rental, fuel and lodging. Americans treat these factors as mundane (and the cultural romanticization of road trips that doesn’t exist anywhere else), but they have real costs. Sure, a plane or a train are more expensive. But it offloads a great deal of cognitive costs as well.
The distance itself doesn’t change though.
Are things really that bad in Europe? In Japan, non-HSR is cheaper than driving, in China HSR is slightly cheaper than gas, and in vietnam I can even put my motorcycle on the train for less than it would cost to drive.
Trains being more expensive than driving sounds like what happens when you have politicians trying to kill your train system.
Totally depends on the country and the route. I don’t live there but have family. They say some train lines are comparable to a plane ticket. Some are cheaper, some are more expensive. The most expensive ones are usually the ones that cross national borders. Though overall the train will always be considered a tiny bit more expensive, it will also be a lot more comfortable. Since the airlines with tickets cheaper than trains usually offer the tiniest seats with zero amenities.
Some countries are better than others as well. In England, trains can get you almost anywhere relatively comfortable and fast (yes, some caveats exist). Spain is rather good in the central regions but many places have spotty coverage. While in Switzerland you can go virtually everywhere except the alps without ever sitting in a car.
The big comparison, that most people fail at, is not just the price of gas. Cars are taxed heavily almost everywhere in the EU. And the tight emissions regulations also require a lot of regular maintenance. So the train will always be more expensive than just the gas, but not more expensive than the bigger picture of car ownership. Plus, if you drive, you’re the sod stuck driving the whole way.
“Offloading cognitive costs” for the sake of convenience is ruining this species.
I meant like paying someone else to drive the plane/train/bus. Not the AI kind.
Having to drive everywhere makes people misserable.
Edit: we take for granted the infrastructure required to support a society that drives everywhere in personal cars. That is what is actually driving the species to extinction via climate change.
I wasn’t just talking about AI.
Being trapped and anxious makes people miserable; lots of people are scared of driving (because they’re bad at it and/or have attached anxiety), and sitting in traffic is frustrating. There’s lots of very good reasons to choose mass transit. The unwillingness to be engaged with the task of driving a car for a few hours is not a good reason, it’s a symptom of a totally cooked attention span.