• SwingingTheLamp@piefed.zip
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    1
    arrow-down
    2
    ·
    5 hours ago

    Europe had coffeehouses in the 17th century, and it became a world-wide commodity by the end of the 18th century, about 200 years before the invention of cars.

    (Reminds me of hearing Johann Sebastian Bach’s Coffee Cantata not long ago.)

    • chonglibloodsport@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      1
      ·
      12 minutes ago

      Roads go back to the Roman Empire and earlier. By the 17th century, road networks were highly developed.

      Nobody was supplying coffee houses by hauling sacks of coffee beans on foot through forests, fields, and river fords. They had ships on the ocean, barges on canals, and wagons on roads.

    • SchmidtGenetics@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      1
      ·
      3 hours ago

      Uhh… you mean the slaves back than…? And the slaves they continue to use in the coffee trade…?

      It’s only affordable because of the slaves, still is, pay everyone an liveable wage along the way, and that’s not happening.

      Sure, shipping is easy when you don’t need to pay and the lives of people don’t matter. But hey, you get your coffee, cheap too!

    • GalacticRobot@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      1
      ·
      5 hours ago

      For sure. Know how much a cup of coffee was inflation adjusted? Roughly $10-15. On top of that those ‘coffee houses’ weren’t remotely close to what you have today. They were bulk brewed diluted black coffee with no sugar or other condiments because those too were expensive. A cup of coffee for the common man in 1700 was roughly 10% of his daily wage. Not exactly sure what point you are even trying to make here though, especially considering the highest cost for getting coffee in the 1700s up to the invention of the car was you guessed it, transportation costs. Invention of the car and transportation networks, why look at that, the price of coffee and other non-local agriculture products plummeted.

      • SwingingTheLamp@piefed.zip
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        1
        arrow-down
        1
        ·
        4 hours ago

        That’s bizarrely incorrect. According to the Bank of England inflation calculator, the cost for a cup in, 18th century Britain would be equivalent to £1.57 now.

        But I’m glad you asked about the point, which is: A functioning, healthy society (with coffee shops, even) does not require everybody driving their private vehicle everywhere, for every function of daily life. In fact, the opposite appears to be true, given that we can draw some pretty direct lines from a car-dominated landscape to the affordability crisis. We could have good lives without streets and roads filled with high-speed traffic.

        • SchmidtGenetics@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          1
          ·
          3 hours ago

          Considering coffee is only cheap because of slaved workers, you’re incredibly missing the point.

          Coffee is only affordable because of mass transport, and that’s only after the slave work is done.